The photos accompanying this article have nothing to do with the Alexander the Great statue. They're of two completely different, much smaller statues of Goce Delchev and Dame Gruev, as the pictured name-plates state. Even if your author couldn't read the Cyrillic script, at least the dates should have given her some clue.

Try harder.

Greece has problem with our name, but Greece has problem with their own minorities,too.Greece has problem with 330 billion euro debt.Greece has problem with demonstration.Greece has problem with......
Too many problems, for the country member of EU.And now we have to change our name because they think so???What a misery nation.

Alexander came where should beee. Alexander The Great or Alexander III Macedonian not helens hellooo, even all the world dont call greece ellas, Greece from one tribe karci, from that came grci greece grec etc. who are greeks. ionian, dorian ( who are they from where camed with the dorian migration) who are u????Alexander son of Phillip II The King of MACEDONIA, not helens not greece, from Pella.Aegean part never was at greece before 1913 NEVER, then the huligans stoll by force and will pay for terorism and breaking human rights to Macedonian in aegean. i can't imagine how can EU take this contry, breaking the basic condition. soo silly and shameful for them!!!!!!!

don't make u're self too smart cause u're not. firstable all classical philologist like me, knows that helenic language first was the language of culture and educated people, and then was replaced with latin. is that mean that when greeks philosophist when teached the roman people makes italy greece? noooo there is also a inscriptiones at greek. second the romans maked their gods like greeks, 12 at number, ares is the same god of the war, zeus= jupiter god of the lightning and also the other, means that roman was helada????? so i think that u're not competent to talk with me about the ancient period.

so Dimitri lets talk about the period that is out of antic. can u explain me why greece before 1976 was  not use the name macedonia, alexander the great..... and that name for greeks and their citizen was prohibited????? and suddenly ooooo greece use this name soooo loud???

Dear Silvana,
No need to be on the offensive, I never said I am smart. Also I do not intend to be competent at all.
What I care about is the forge of history attempted by the propagandists of FYROM and this is what I want to oppose. I, by no means, want to oppose simple and descent people like you.
Glad to see that you are a philologist as you claim. I humbly confess I am not. Yet I like getting historical knowledge as an amateur.
Now, the Romans were not Greeks but simply influenced by the Greek civilization and life-style of the time, while Macedonians were Greek people, so the two examples are irrelevant.
Additionally the Romans replaced Greek with Latin language in several cases as you correctly say while the Macedonians promoted the Greek one.
It is natural that people promote their own language at any case. The same happens today where French or English or the Russians promoted their languages and not the languages of others.
So the Macedonians promoted the Greek language simply because they were Greeks.
Regarding the language the ancient Macedonians were speaking, first of all I have to repeat what Gustav Weigand and most linguists claim that“language by itself does not make any safe criterion/proof about someone’s National identity.
This means that ancient Macedonians are not identified being either Greeks or not just because of their language.
All of the facts stated by me in my June 23, 2011 19:16 posting about Macedonians’ Greek identity are necessary to identify them as Greeks.
As you have seen all of these facts are solid and bond nicely with the same facts about the other Greeks and give proofs about ancient Macedonians Greek identity.

Also the vast majority of the world academians agree to this.
Please find below two relative academic comments:
(1)
For a long while Macedonian onomastics, which we know relatively well thanks to history, literary authors, and epigraphy, has played a considerable role in the discussion. In our view the Greek character of most names is obvious and it is difficult to think of a Hellenization due to wholesale borrowing. ‘Ptolemaios’ is attested as early as Homer, ‘Alexandros’ occurs next to Mycenaean (archaic Greek) feminine a-re-ka-sa-da-ra- (‘Alexandra’), ‘Laagos’, then ‘Lagos’, matches the Cyprian ‘Lawagos’, etc. The small minority of names which do not look Greek, like ‘Arridaios’ or ‘Sabattaras’, may be due to a substratum or adstatum influences (as elsewhere in Greece).
Macedonian may then be seen as a Greek dialect, characterised by its marginal position and by local pronunciations (like ‘Berenika’ for ‘Ferenika’,etc.).
Yet in contrast with earlier views which made of it an Aeolic dialect (O.Hoffmann compared Thessalian) we must by now think of a link with North-West Greek (Locrian, Aetolian, Phocidian, Epirote).
This view is supported by the recent discovery at Pella of a curse tablet (4th cent. BC) which may well be the first ‘Macedonian’ text attested (provisional publication by E.Voutyras; cf. the Bulletin Epigraphique in Rev.Et.Grec.1994, no.413); the text includes an adverb ‘opoka’ which is not Thessalian. We must wait for new discoveries, but we may tentatively conclude that Macedonian is a dialect related to North-West Greek.Olivier Masson, French linguist, « Oxford Classical Dictionary:Macedonian Language», 1996
(2)
To judge by their personal names and by the names of the months of the calendar;
Macedonian ambassadors could appear before the Athenian assembly without needing interpreters;
in all Demosthenes sneers about their civilization there is no hint that Macedonians spoke other than Greek, another testify of Macedonians Greek tongue----George Cawkwell "Philip of Macedon,"----
I am sure that as a classical philologist that you are you will find my above sources and links interesting the less.
Of course I shall be glad to receive any dispute through facts regarding my above arguments about the ancient Macedonians Greek language and identity.
Also I shall be glad to receive your possible links about your opposing arguments. Thnk u.

other thing, i read it the fragment of strabon but i didnt see anything, what u wanna show with that, u talk about alexander the great who was the last king of argeadi and u show text after that from other dinasty and period after that. u're losing u're self in the facts.

Idon’t know where did you find this, where did you read it or who told you so,whatever, this is absolutely wrong and far from being real!
 
Thename of Macedonia was never banned in Greece.
Plssee the facts below:
1.
"Macedonia"newspaper, established 1911
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Makedonia_(newspaper)
So“Macedonia” is been held and read by thousands of Greeks every day continually,for almost a century.
Whatdo you think? The name Macedonia banned?
 
Notthe only case of course that disintegrates the propaganda you are subject to!
Plssee more:
 
2.
"Macedonianhalva", since 1924
http://www.macedonianhalva.gr/en/profile.htm
 
3.
"Makedonikos"football team, established 1928
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Makedonikos_F.C.
 
4.
Greekgeography school book 1939
http://history-of-macedonia.com/wordpress/2009/11/16/greek-geography-school-books-and-fyrom-propaganda/
 
5.
Societyfor Macedonian Studies Theater , established 1939
http://www.hyper.gr/ems/
 
6.
MacedoniaPalace Hotel, built 1970
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Makedonia_Palace
 
7.
Alexanderthe Great statue in Thessaloniki, erected 1974
http://www.greek-tours.co.uk/greece/greece-Pages/Image13.html
 
8.
MacedonianCentre for Contemporary Art, established 1979
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macedonian_Museum_of_Contemporary_Art
9.
"Makedonikos"wine since 1983 (firm est. since 1890)
http://www.tsantali.gr/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=137&yt_color=barwine&Itemid=36&lang=en
 
FromGreeks living abroad:
1.
PanmacedonianAssociation USA, established 1947
http://www.panmacedonian.info/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=80&Itemid=64
2.
Panmacedonianassociation of Melbourne established 1961
http://www.macedonians.com.au/panmacedonian/index.html
3.
MacedonianSociety of Great Britain, established 1989
http://www.macedonia.org.uk/
 
Sothe name of Macedonia was never prohibited neither in 1911, nor in 1924, norin 1928, nor… nor in 1983 – never – ever!
Aseverybody can see the name of Macedonia not only was never banned but it wasalways a name of pride and esteem for Greece.
 

Silvana mu!
 Dhen pistevo na min kseris elinika or grece pes oti thes korici mu ala fovame oti dhen tha sas ftasune ta krimata ke oi anthropi na filate,kratisete,ganxhonete oxi mono ton Aleksandro ala ke ton Alogo tu,dhioti Historia "petai" mono mia fora ke....mono.,agalma oso thes ke otan thes ke pos to thelis.
Syncerely Besnik Cani (From Tirana Albania)
Mr Dimitris ean borite na to metefrazete ja tin qiria Silvana tha sas ime efgnomon mia zoi ditoti par olo pu zo stin usa  dhen mu vjeni sta aglika,olo afto to ahkti po eko mesa mu and I belive all a normal people around in this Planet(if still too....

 .

why u mixed u'reself with macedonia which was country best at wars but in culture helens were the best and that knows all the world. 

now i saw about using the name macedonia, so why was the genocides to macedonians in aegas, why they were punished about????????they said clearly that the greek language learn it with the greek propagande and at home they spoke macedonian scared not to be heard from the greek authoryties, hearing at their doors??????

@Ant
1)     
At my posting just above yours Istate the Statue of Alex the Great that has been erected in Salonica since 1970(case 7). There is also bust of him in the outskirts of Athens seen from A6motorway leading to Athens from Peloponesse. Do you think we should erectalways statues of the same historic personality?
2)     
Correct and everybody knows this.And Piraeus will never be Athens. And London will never be New York. And Tokyowill never be Moscow. And Berlin will never be Paris. And Paris will never beMadrid. So what is your point?
3)     
Macedonia was always within theborders of the Greek world. It was never considered as “non-Greek”
4)     
Apart from a small 10%(approximately) which was part of ancient Macedonia the rest 90% of FYROM lieswhere the ancient Paeonia was. So Paeonia is a more proper name for thiscountry. To note that from the ancient information we have it is very possiblethat Paeonians were also a distant Greek tribe of the north.
5)     
As I said the place where FYROM isnow was within the area of the Paeonian kingdoms. Later it was conquered byMacedonia and incorporated in it. So FYROM was not Macedonia even in ancienttimes.
6)     
The problem is that propagandistsfrom Skopje try to usurp the Greek history in their attempt to give some basisto their territorial claims against a neighbouring country (Greece).Territorial claims are completely unacceptable inside today’s Europe. It is sadthat these people seem to live some 100 years back in the past.  
7)     
 Trying to present history in acompletely different way from the accepted one by distorting historical facts!How could you call this?

Silvana, yousay:
<<ifwe start to think logically not historical all the neighbors of republic ofmacedonia says that macedonia is theirs. whyy?>>
 
I don’t knowwhat other neighbours of FYROM may say and their possible claims against yourcountry, if so this is absolutely unacceptable and they should stop any claimson you.
FYROM shouldalso abandon any claims against territories of neighbouring countries.
There is no “AegeanMacedonia” that has to be “liberated” and united with your country; it neverwas; this was a name invented by those who wanted to seize the Greek area ofMacedonia. Your authorities have to abandon this policy and stop thinking thatyour borders should end to Olympus Mountain.
Greece saysthat Macedonia is Greek and refers to its northern territorial area and its historicand cultural background only and not to your country, so Greece has no claimson you.
And becauseMacedonia is Greek and since you are not Greece, you have to find adetermination for your county’s name that shall be more proper about yournational identity.
 
Greece cannotaccept a country usurping a clearly distinguished Greek name, something thatwill be always a source of claims and bad neighbouring.

@ anonymous(Besnik Cani)
AgapiteBesnik Cani, pistevo oti katalabenis oti den ine dinaton na kano metafrasiallon atomon edo pera. Ektos ton allon iparxi panta o kindinos na po katilathos. Prepei na pnigume to axti mas ke na prospathume afto pu leme na ginetekatanoito kai kirios na min prosbalume. Na ise kala kai na exis prokopi eki puzeis.
 

oo again the ancient period!!!! lets talk about that, firts u said that alexander II was member of Olimpic games??? yes but he confused the helenic cause he told his first name of his native place just argos, but argos orestian, not argos in pelpones, he lied them, second alexander II filhelen called himself whyy?can i call my self macedonianfillos or u fillgreeks noo if u are from greece. friend to helen can be someone who is not helen, that not have a sense to call u're self friend of u're pepole. mike the bike says corectly a wonderfull thing. other thing albanian has their rights in macedonia to learn at their language has jobs everything, but why these people of aegean says that they are macedonian to the greeks reseching, why they not say bulgarian, why? u watched the video that i said to watch it? why u dont wanna see it. the reserch was from greeks people no matter who posted at youtube

very smart questiones!!!!he talks just for the ancient period.uste ednas bravo za toj sto go napisal ova:))))

@ Silvana
Regardingthe term “philhellene”.
1.
Isocratessays at his “Evagoras” about the Cypriot King and the Cypriots:
“… they haveundergone so great a change that they strive with one another to see who shallbe regarded as most (friendly to the Greeks (= philhellenes with the Greektext)) …”
Pls see thetext:
http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.01.0144%3Aspeech%3D9%3Asection%3D50
2.
Isocratesalso called at his “Panegyricus” his fellow Athenians as Philhellenes.(Panegyricus, 96):
“And yet howcould men be shown to be braver or more (devoted to Hellas (= philhellenes withthe Greek text))  than our ancestors …”
Pls see thetxt here:
http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.01.0144%3Aspeech%3D4%3Asection%3D96
 
So didIsocrates believe that the Cypriot King Evagoras or more, his Atheniancompatriots were not Greeks when he called them Philhellenes?
Not at all!That would be naive to think so!
3.
Also theAthenian Xenophon at his “Agesilaus” calls the Spartan King to be a Philhellene(Agesilaus 7.4)
“Again, ifit is honourable in one who is a Greek to be a (friend to the Greeks, (=philhellenes with the Greek text))  whatother general has the world seen unwilling to take a city when he thought thatit would be sacked, or who looked on victory in a war against Greeks as adisaster?”
The txthere:
http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.01.0210%3Atext%3DAges.%3Achapter%3D7%3Asection%3D4
So did theAthenian Xenophon that the Spartan King was not a Greek?
Again theanswer is no.
Several othercases exist in the ancient scripts (e.g. in Plato’s) where Greeks call otherGreeks as Philhellenes which means that the term was used from Greeks toGreeks.
So don’tthink about the term “philhellene” with his contemporary use.
Today theterm responds to non-Greek people that are friends of Greece/Greeks.
During theancient times however the term was given as a title to those Greeks who hadcaused some benefit to the total of Greece/Greeks.
After Greecewas occupied by the Romans it was given to some Romans too.
So, dearSilvana, I think it’s easy for you now to realize why the Greeks called theMacedonian King Alexander I, a Philhellene!

Interesting answers... A part of truth, +something to avoid, +changing some facts, +elaborated a lot, +not directly answered, + litlle excuse= we've got a result = "TRUTH"...the dogma... I've got on my mind that we spoke about 2 different things? About Earth & Mars, maybe?
I've asked from when? - You answered:
"From 1912-13, some 90% of the original area of the ancient Macedonian Kingdom (and not 51% as you say) was incorporated to Greece..."- but you didn't answered how? Quietly? Peaceful? Or with war? Together with your companions Serbs & Bulgars? In the time, that we know as Balkan's Wars? Wars about territory of Macedonia? And now, the same group - speaks the same mantra: Macedonian are not existing, Macedonian are not existing... Interesting, they also said that territory of Macedonia is belonging to them?!
You said: "It’s true that some 10% (area of Bitola -Pelagonia) was left out of the Greek borders." What you mean? You'll tried to take it? Peaceful again? Like 1912-13? Is this answer explain - why Milosevic 1991 made a proposal to Greek goverment to divide Macedonia, and your army had maneuvers six months on macedonian border? For any case, maybe?
If you are so belief about area of Bitola - Pelagonia is teritory of Greece, why you don't come to visit Bitola, and see the people, speach... They don't speak greece, aren't they? And how, when I'll (macedonian) go in Northern Greece (Greek Macedonia) - understend on market - everything? Slavophones - people which you are so afraid to call them with their real name - Macedonians? Slavophones-what are they? Some new nattion? What a wish...
And - the top-answer: "Macedonian Abecedary was for the Bulgarian minority..." Chaos,man! Yo... Macedonian Abecedary for Bulgars? So, why they didn't call it - Bulgarian Abecedary?  They didn't have letter B? It looks like Alexander theme - he was a Greek, but they called him - Macedonian?
At the end, answer with "changing names": Turks did that, Russians also? Where? In conquered lands? Your example: Konigsberg - Kaliningrad was a part of East Prussia (Germany) untill 1945! - I don't understand the aim of this answer? Are you  admiting something?
So after that, I must agree with all your answers, and I accept that I'm victim of our propagandists. You have all the facts - and the gods must be silent...

http://macedonianspark.com/images/stories/Istorija/prviotustav.jpg1) Greeks can be:

2) a) All citizens of Greece who believe in Christ.
3) b) All those believers in Christ, that under the Ottoman yoke, arrived or will arrive inthe Greek state to fight or to settle.
4) e) All those foreigners who pristagnaa and registered as citizens.
   Subject of interest: To be the "Grecian" was enough to be a Christian!To make the paradox even more to remember "The Greeks" their first PresidentGeorge Konduriotis (1782-1858) who was Prime Minister of Greece during the reign ofOtto of Bavaria as king of Greece, and later G.K. became the first president of the Greek state (1823-1826).
G. Konduriotis comes from famous Albanian family who no doubt gave his greatcontribution to the Greek Revolution. The original family name was Zervas, but it waschanged to Konduriotis according to one of their ancestors who was a resident of the village Kountora, Megarida.
Lazaros Konduriotis His brother who fought in the Greek War of Independence in 1821years. was called "Father of the Nation."
G grandson. Konduriotis, Pavlos, was celebrated after the First Balkan War and wastwice elected President of Greece. Georgios Konduriotis was an Albanian who knewonly the Albanian language and became the first Greek president.

"The Greek government officials rule their first Mr. Chairman. Konduriotis his name is not mentioned in any modern Greek text because of political sensitivity about hisAlbanian origin, "wrote George Finley in his book" History of the Greek Revolution "of1861.
"We spoke earlier Albanian Romejci and call, but then Winckelmann, Goethe, VictorHugo, Delakrois, they told us:" No, you are Helen, direct descendants of Plato and Socrates, "and it happened. If a small, poor nation and put such a burden on theshoulders, will never heal. "(Nikos Dimov - in an interview titled "Elgin Marble Argument in a New Light" on the New York Times, June 23, 2009)

The 1930 was quite acceptable for the Greeks to call the language spoken in Macedonia as "Macedonian" and its inhabitants as "Macedonians."

I will quote literary testimonies of six late 19th and early 20th century:

1st In his book "Martyrs 'and Heroes' Blood" writer Jon national Dragumis says "'Macedonian' is the correct term for the determination of this language, which the Bulgarians, as he says, delusional called" Bulgarian ".

2nd In his work "In the Secret Places of the Marsh" which was first issued under Metaksoviot regime in 1937, Penelope Delta refers to the Slavic Macedonian language as 'Macedonian dialect', though in the next row tendentious refers to him as "Macedonian , ... a mixture of Slavic and Greek. "

4th Telling about life in Greece in the book "When I was a boy in Greece" published in 1913, George Demitrius describes harsh conditions of life under Ottoman despotism and organized resistance from the locals, in Chapter 11, the 132 will enroll :
-"No posing or Turks or Greeks, Bulgarians, we call them, but their language is not Bulgarian but Macedonian dialect, and I found wonderful people among them, sincere, hospitable, and polite."

OK Dimitri, every question. has his own answer. War is OK, assimilation is OK, that's the history, it's a common practice (for everyone), that's the way how the things go on...
I didn't understand - Do you have Bulgarian minority, or Slavophones are speaking Bulgarian, or they are Greeks who speaks Bulgarian? And Abecedar was published for them? With Macedonian letters? Because, Bulgarian had different letters, similar, but not the same. No problem for that (You didnt know), but why today Greek goverment doesn't published the Abecedary again?
I didn't understand also - Did you conquered 51% teritory of Macedonia in 1912-13? Or how did you said: annexation?! Did you mean liberation? Interested freedom they've got...Asimilation, forrbiden to spoke their own language, burned churches, destroyed graves, not allow to back to their homeland - but that's the history - no hard feelings...

I was asked some  questions - you answered... We spoke like deaf & blind...
You tried to explane to me about Greece rights, welthy history, rich, common practice, your superiority, - I'm not enjoy maybe, no one to blame (maybe history?!)- but still I don't understand one thing - Why you are angry on your situation, today? Why you are accusing politicians, EU, USA? Maybe, history to blame?
So let us Dimitri, to make some wrong things: To call our contry - Macedonia, to call ourselfs - Macedonians, (we don't have problem if  you are calling yourself - Macedonians also), to raise our (wrong) monuments, (we don't have problem if  you have the same), to speak our own macedonian language (you can called it any how)...
Maybe you do not enjoy, but  that's the reality (history) - that's the way how the things go on...

Trikoupis statement that: "If we win, we will makeall of them Greeks" clear, unambiguous recognition that:
(A) Greeceis Macedonia'spossession.
(B) Macedoniawas never Greek before the "Great War" in 1913,

WhyFYROM propaganda is so predictable?
ShouldI thank God for this?
 

Theusual argument about Harilaos Trikoupis’ statement! Only that nobody ever stated when exactly did he saythis!
Trikoupisspeaks about Greeks and Bulgarians. He says nothing about “ethnic Macedonians”simply because such a Nation never existed!
 
BesidesTrikoupis was proven wrong about this saying as the Bulgarians who lived inMacedonia never became Greeks and most of them left for Bulgaria
Ofinterest is that those who left Greece chose to go to Bulgaria and did notenter the Yugoslavian Macedonia. This gives a clue about these people's nationalidentity.
Alsothe Greeks who lived in Bulgaria never became Bulgarians and they left forGreece.
 
SoTrikoupis was wrong and the populations were never assimilated but remained andwere self-identified either as Greeks or as Bulgarians to the end.

WhyFYROM propaganda is so predictable?
What’snext?
MacedonianDNA may be?
Africanorigin of Greeks?
AsiaMinor refugees are Turks?
Greece never existed?
Ormay be “Macedonian” Lexikon of XVI century?

@ someone who exists
Demosthenesas well – that’s for sure – no joke!
Hewas a fanatic localist, an overweening Athenian, opponent to all non-AthenianGreeks - the Macedonians especially - and as such he used the worst againstthem – quite reasonable don’t you think?
YetI never used any arguments without facts.
Alsofor any opposing arguments, I confronted  I did with the use of factstoo. If my facts are weak you or anyone else can reverse and prove them wrong.
 
RegardingGreece’s neighbours you are not that right; we really enjoy very good relationswith Bulgaria, a former enemy. Bulgarians are honest and we enjoy this. I thinkwe respond the same way and the outcome of such a good relationship is a steadyand close collaboration in many issues.
Albaniawas also an enemy of the past but a steady friend in our days.
Serbiais no longer a neighbor but we retain the same excellent relations that lastfrom the past.
Wehave to build bridges – you are right the most- I absolutely agree.
These bridges arenot built on claims however or they collapse in seconds.
 
Ifyou go to a school in your country and ask the pupils “where do the borders ofMacedonia (your country) end?” they answer: “at mount Olympus!” howevereverybody knows that the borders between our two countries are set furthernorth.
 
Howdo you think we can build bridges if you teach in your schools the children tobelieve that the borders of their country should end at Olympus Mountain?
 
Howclaims can be justified?
Tosay “it’s mine because I like it” is rather childish.
Historygives basis to the claims. Does Roman history belong to Italy? Yes, but also toEurope.
JuliusCaesar however belongs to Italy.
Spain,France or Germany never attempted to claim him as theirs.
 
Alexthe Great was a Greek, simply because I have proven through my first postingshere that Macedonians were Greek people.
His acts give more proofs to this. not stated - I can do if you like.
To claim him as non-Greek – despiteall these facts – justifies what I said above about claims.
 
DoI believe that you can conquer the Greek region of Macedonia?
Didanyone believe in 1832 that the tiny Greek Kingdom of that time would have over-doubledits territories in less than 100 years?
 
CanI accept you as Macedonians?
Please stop all these historical, cultural and territorial claims and you shall have my answer.

p.s i founded the original text at ancient greek at perseus and translate that, not english version.

other think i want to send a texts where was written somethink about macedonian kings not sparta, athens and persia. do not mix things.

www.historyofmacedonia.org/AncientMacedonia/borza.html

hahahhaahhahahha se znae cij e makedonski car, kako i goce delcev i ostanatite. cel zivot ste aramii i kradaci bugarcinja i takvi ke ostanete. ako odis vo bugarija pazi da ne se vratis bez nisto. vie ke se tepate za makedonija ama za sto za da ja prisvoite hahaha. vie ste otepani od gospod a ne da se tepate za nekoj selani edni

Re:anonymous О, неразумни и юроде, поради что се срамиш да се наречеш българин? Don't make me laugh, macedonian car....you never had a car. The promacedonian propaganda that Yugoslavians did has brainwashed you, that's for sure.
Can you explain me then why it's written everywhere, and I mean everywhere...  Basil II the Bulgar-slayer, not the macedonian slayer, ah?
As it is here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basil_II
 On July 29, 1014, Basil II and his general Nikephoros Xiphias outmanoeuvred the Bulgarian army, which was defending one of the fortified passes, in the Battle of Kleidion. Samuel avoided capture only through the valour of his son Gabriel. Having crushed the Bulgarians, Basil was said to have captured 15,000 prisoners and blinded 99 of every 100 men, leaving 150 one-eyed men to lead them back to their ruler. Samuel was physically struck down by the dreadful apparition of his blinded army, and he died two days later after suffering a stroke. Although the extent of Basil's mistreatment of the Bulgarian prisoners may have been exaggerated, this incident helped to give rise to Basil's nickname of Boulgaroktonos, "the Bulgar-slayer", in later tradition.

That's what's written from the historians from the time of the events, not from your so called history books - but go ahead, you own the Moon, the Milky way, Adam and Eva were Macedonians, you just don't know where to stop.

Borza!
It seems that Borza's writings are very well accepted!

With regards to what the students in your country are taught about the “real” borders of your country I have this little but enlightening video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eTUqfuTbk_s&feature=related
Interesting to see that the kids in your country say that the borders of your country end to mount Olympus or in Larissa a city in central Greece.
The question was set later before your foreign minister who tried to answer it in a rather naïve way.


Yet this is not the only case of course. Student at the productive Military schools of your country are taught that the area of Macedonia in Greece is a place “under occupation that has to be liberated”!


Do you think that this kind of education may construct bridges of friendship in future?

With regards to Julius Caesar, do French, Polish, Russians or Czech people claim him as being a non-Italian but French, Polish etc?
Please do clarify something to me: does your government intend to erect the giant statue of Alexander the Great in order to honour him as a Greek historic important personality?
You say:
<<This dialog looks like a monolog. Like I said at begging: deaf & blind were spoken...>>
I think I am not the one that has put these nasty rules of claims.

hahahahahaaa i cant stop laughing. firstable dimitri u're version about the slavonian as u say, are made in the new history, made by russian in the situation when macedonia was divided cause that people slavonian camed  behind the carpathians which means at the side of russia is behind carpathia. second greeks came to the balkan  from todays calling iran, few people with determinated language of words. macedonian or the vindi ( slavonian asu say) were here. greeks tooks words from maceodnian and made their language. the god zeus as u say is dzeus and it means zvezda becouse in that time the sun and the stars were gods and at macedonian stars is dzevzda , big mother and here is dzeus which brother were makedon. second korinthos what means at greek nothing but in transcriptions comes from kora or at eng.crust, and this land looks like a bed or mac. korito where zeus washed his legs sitting on the throne. there is too many words that says that greeks stoll macedonian mithology and word and make a language adding -os, as etc. there isn't time to talk for some ,,nation". who are greeks at the ancient texts ionian are divided from greece. in the persian war greeks and ionian went in a war as it writes, dorian who are they came and assimilated spartans people sooo where is the greeks here, nowhere. we cant discus. greece is in dispute with turkey, macedonian and now albania is searching its part. soo can all be fool and one smart???

DearAnonymous, all of the theories you exposed just above are simplyunattested. Have they ever been presented to any internationalcongress of historic or archaeological studies so to receive anyapproval?
Not at all!These are theories directed towards you by the “scientists”and  "scholars" of your country simply for propaganda reasons.
Yousay that Greeks received words by the Macedonians without use of anyhistorical proof.
Thewhole case does not justify such an assumption as the words werecommon to all the people that inhabited the Greek peninsula (theGreeks actually – Macedonians included).
Sowho did receive by whom? Why Greeks from Macedonians as you say andnot both sharing a common language through their dialects as mostscholars worldwide claim?
Further,how is it possible that we came from Iran area and received wordsfrom Macedonians?
A prerequisiteto the above should be that the people were mixed to each other, or awar or a cultural and commercial activity took place at a very earlystage, so that we received these elements.
To say here thatthis kind of influence is always bidirectional and not from one sideonly. However this is not the case here as there are only commonwords and not words that belong to one side only that were receivedby the other.
Actuallythere is no evidence about any from the above mentioned activities (war,commerce etc) to have taken place before 800 BC, where the ancientGreek language was formed the way we know it now. This simply means thatthe words were not taken by the “Greeks” or the “Macedonians”but were used by all these people in common as I already mentioned –or if you know any different case just let us know!
Sincethe scholars world wide, have accepted the Greek language as aprimitive language, it is natural that the Macedonian language was aGreek dialect as its vocabulary shared nearly everything with therest of the other Greek dialects of the time.
Now,the Greek Nation was made up by the total of the Greek tribes(Ionians, Dorians etc) as this is attested by the answer theAthenians gave to the Spartans prior to the battle of Plataea . Fromthis we understand that they considered each other as been parts ofthe same (Greek) Nation. To note here that Macedonians were of Dorian stock.

By saying “vindi”you are probably referring to the “Veneti” people.
There are two groups of ancient people under this name. The Veneti living at north of the Adriatic gulf and the Veneti living at the area of the Baltic Sea .
The first were probably people of Illyrian or Latin descent, the second are of undefined origin. (could be of Slavic, Germanic or Baltic stock).
Some Slovenian scholars claimed through a theory that the Adriatic Veneti were proto-Slavs. This theory was objected by other Slovenian and International scholars as well and is considered now as not active.
They never received any approval through any international conference, so no reason to make any fuss about it.
All these theories (like the silly one about deciphering the Rosetta stone by your Tentov-Bosefski genius ...amateurs in archaeology ) are used for propaganda reasons only by the FYROM authorities and are of no value.

Ants, Windisch, Phoenicians, Veneti and other peoples in the Balkan and in Europe of the genus of course Windisc, they're sinonymous with the Slavs. So Dimitri the Windisch or Vindi and Veneti are different tribes form slavs Windisch

According to Herodotus, the ancient Greeks borrowed their alphabet from the Phoenicians, then the SE Veneti Enei or those living in northern Asia Minor. From them has survived to this day toponymy such as Tabor, Suez, Golan, etc. Dardanelles. In Greece and its islands is also keeping the toponymy. Here are a few place names najkaraterni venetski: Island of Karpathos, Rhodes Island, Lakka - Lucky, Langada, Langonikos, Longos, Accra, Rodja, Stratoniki, Stratones, Stratonision, Stratis, Stratis IBM Island and countless others, almost without exception ancient fenikijski, venetski,antski or underscore ancient Macedonian

@
<<Ants,Windisch, Phoenicians, Veneti and other peoples in the Balkan and in Europe ofthe genus of course Windisc, they're sinonymous with the Slavs. So Dimitri theWindisch or Vindi and Veneti are different tribes form slavs Windisch>>
 
Quite interesting information; can you provideany relative link(s) about all these?

@ anonymous
Max Fasmer (or Vasmer) has not saidsomething new.
Regarding the Greek toponymes of Slavicorigin, this led Fallmerayer to his erroneous theory about modern Greeks derivingfrom Slavs. The theory was based mainly on the Slavic names of the Greektoponymes and a few more false information that were adopted recklessly by him(like the Pitakis’ document).
Whatever, it was proven wrong by manyscholars of the time (eg the Germans
 Hopf, Thiersch and the Slovenian  Kopitar)   andnow this theory rests in peace along with its inventor.
Since 1870s when Hopf wrote the “Slavs inGreece” that reversed, with use of several facts, Fallmerayer’s ideas, no one elsehas ever attempted to support again similar theories.

The Roman Julius Caesar belongs to theItalian Nation and a recognizable historical figure for the Italian Historylike the Athenian Pericles belongs to the Greek Nation and the Greek History,the Corsican Napoleon belongs to the French Nation and the French History andthe Prussian Bismarck belongs to the German Nation and the German History andnot a historical figure claimed by the Polish or the Lithuanians.
Alexander the Great belongs to the GreekNation and makes up a recognizable historical figure for the Greek Nation too.
I guess you probably don’t like it but I amsorry to say who cares about what you or I like in person.
 

Please doelaborate and express yourself.
Please dogive us a clue about what do you mean through all these?
Can thePortuguese claim Caesar as a National symbol?
To mylimited knowledge only the Italians can do so. Right? Are they wrong?
Should theChinese claim him as a National symbol as well or should theLithuanians also claim Bismarck as a National symbol too?

Don't argue with an idiot, they'll only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience ;)

@ someone
I am sorry to say this does not make any sense.
How can it be possible that Napoleon can be a hero for non-French people?
Can you advise the reasons why he could have been a National symbol for the British, the Germans or the Japanese for example?

By their freedom of choise, from theirs natural rights, their discretion, free will, emancipation & etc.-  for  me - are fundamental and very good reasons...

ooo poore greeks tribes, irans pirates, came to Balkan with a language of few words and think that they are the nation of culture, nooo wild people u stoll u're language and alphabet from phoenicians and ancient macedonians ( slavonians) were at balkan before u ass holes and made u're own language with adding to the word -os ets. byeee greece and kill u'reself each other haahahahahahhahahaaajahaahahahah

Do the greeks really understand that as the world does not revolve around Athens, although a mountain of the EU budget/Money is at this time pouring down a large hole in the government buildings. Never to be seen again, except maybe in the pockets of the corrupt.There are a lot more important things on the agenda than. Should the Republic of Macedonia be called something else. What does it matter, most of you getting all steamed up about it should remember, that the Country of Macedonia has existed for at least a generation and that you will all be dead by the time two more generations have been born.I don't know what the family name of Dimitri from Athens is, but I am sure that if he was told tomorrow that his name was no longer acceptable, his reaction to whoever tells him that, is they should get stuffed.Well Dimitri? Right or wrong

@someone
Youstill remain unintelligible to me.
Inever said that I support the idea of National purity. This however does notmean that we are irrelevant to the ancient Greeks. My arguments can be found asper above. Alexander the Great is part of the Greek history and as such is partof our history. If you are a Greek you are participant to this history; if notyou have your own history that is different and has nothing to do withAlexander and all the rest of the Greek one; eg Tsar Samuel is part of theBulgarian history and I – as a Greek – am not justified  to claim him as a Greek king! That would beimproper the less!
Myargument about claiming other people’s property/history etc was quite clear andaccurate I think but you preferred to mix Caesar with Porsche instead of givingyour own arguments.
Orto reverse my argument: can I, as a Greek, claim Tsar Samuel the Bulgarian asmy national hero?

ooo puree dimitri u and all these people,where u read it that macedonians are greeks why not only greeks, why macedonian??? ionian also were not greeks even the dorian hahha who are greeks. i read a piece of history where the greeks called themselfs for battle with persians and is written by herodotus greeks and ionians get in battle with persians and macedonian and thessalian let the persians to attack greece from theirs teritory. Macedonians are different tell us this.....

macedonia is not greek and never will be greeks think they created the world and its history  what idiots.

greeks must learn to unlearn there fake history fordged by its story tellers . greece and its, can i say greek people must never forget the bulkan war in 1913 where greece stole at least half of macedonia's land.
and in saying that greece does say that its borders did expand in the bulkan wars they show us this proof .
greeks like (dimitri from athens) should realy read up on history and find out where he comes from, most ill educated people like ( dimitri from athens) are greeks that come from turkey that read rubish on top of rubish .
greeks are short and fat with big parrot like nose's unlike the macedonian tall strong and goodlooking. ha ha macedonia will crush greece again long live macedonia

@bobi
PS.I see you are full of hate against the refugees.
That’snatural.
Inability to defend your propaganda created positions against truth brings hate againstothers.
Natural,shameful and sad…

Hello Greeks,

Your a nation who lives for your so called glory years thousands of years ago. Let go of the past and accept the fact that its only a matter of time before the Republic of Macedonia is made official. Instead of focusing on the Republic of Macedonia bordering your nation, why dont you put your efforts into the massive internal issues you have with debt, unemployment and lazy culture you all have to working hard! The EU should teach you a lesson and let you default, then you will all have to work hard to pull yourselves out of the whole your in. The Republic of Macedonia always has been and always will just that!

Recently my friend was visited in Belgrade by her girlfriend from Skopje, and she was that stupid to say that they (Macedonians) were not Slavs. For me that is total ignorance and blessed brainwashing similar to that of Nazi Germany's epic adventure in Himalayan region before WWII to "validate" that they are super race. Also the Croats said a several years ago that they have Persian heritage.... Montenegrin say now that they don't have any connection to Serbian people and yet their greatly treasured kind Njegos said and wrote that he is Serbian and that they are Serbian's yeah and all the people from Balkans came from Krypton.To sum it up, it is now shame to be of Slavic origin and all the independent states that came from Yugoslavia started to create some new identity. It is as simple as this, the regions settled by the South Slavs greatly influenced the people (language, religion etc.). It is fair to say that the Balkans is a great mixture of nation's that are now trying to present themselves as unique as possible. Macedonians (slavic) should understand that if they have some monuments from hellenic period that does not mean that they are descendants of ancient Macedonians, you can find in today's Turkey there is many monuments from hellenic period (Ephesus, Millet and Troy) and they are not Greeks. We (Serbs) could say that we are roman descendants because 8 roman emperors were born in today's Serbia the most known of all was emperor Constantine (Nis-Naisus).http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/548156/Slav?anchor=ref221386      

@Dimitri From Athens

"5)   They participated in the ancient Olympic Games. Everybody knows thatAncient Olympic Games was the most important event in the Greek worldand the participant athletes had to be Greeks according to therules. No Persians, Egyptians or even the Illyrians or Thracians,people with closely related kinship to the Greeks had everparticipated. That means that Macedonians considered themselves asGreeks and also that the rest of the Greeks considered them as Greekstoo."
i know a quote which says "firs day in school is the most important, why? cause of the first impression!" 
Now do you know what was the first reaction of the Hellens when aknowledged that Macedonia wanted to participate? They REFUSE and DENIED by all costs! But Olimpics were so interesting and done in high style that will eventually buy Macedonians to say they are Hellens or Friends of the Hellens so they can entry on the games. First time its important to mention that they were refused. 
And one more thing, i think with my own head, what is righteous what is logical not what is written on the internet books cause i know and many others too that its fake and its written by the Greek propaganda. Ancient Macedonian language is not greek nor ever was my friend. Lie lies in the very smallest details! And do you know whats that small detail ? :) ALEXANDER HAD WITH HIM TRANSLATOR SO HE COULD COMMUNICATE WITH HIS SUPPORTIVE "ARMIES"- SLAVES FROM HELLAS- BINGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Now whats more likely to be? They spoke the same language or they dont ? :) Now you and THOUSANDS of other can come and show to me and introduce to me an arthefacts or whatever, which i know is more likely that alexander wrote them on greek same as me i would sign on english so everyone could understand it ;) - he did ... but not that he was speaking GREEK AS NATIVE LANGUAGE OR WAS HELLEN :) thats a very big difference and no one can deny it. Any try to go against that small detail which is EVERYWHERE mentioned in the books and info for the battle against Persia is absolute RIDICULOUS 

Dear Dux,I appreciate the time taken for you to respond through all this.However I have already answered to most of these points to otherguys so I think it boring to start again.
Just tofocus only to some points from your plethoric writing: Yr points in<< . >>
<<Alexanderthe Great spoke language that was unknown to the hellenes and notunderstandable so they must to use translators like they did in thewar against persia when on macedonian side were 30.000 slaves fromhellas, and in order to communicate alexander brought and translator,fact and proven. >>
The Greekmercenaries (30,000) serving with the Persian Army was not a uniquephenomenon; Greek mercenaries served many Armiew and people duringthe antiquity (eg the 10,000 Greek mercenaries served under thePersian Cyrus, Greek mercenaries in Egypt etc)
1. Alexandernever used any translator to communicate with the Greeks.
2. There isno source to state that Macedonians could not communicate with therest of the Greeks.
3. What isstated, is that a Greek general of Alexander had to pass his ordersto a Macedonian officer first and not directly to his Macedoniansoldiers. This does not mean necessarily that the Greek general andthe Macedonians were not speaking the same language. Different Greekdialects for sure but not other than Greek.
<<Greek name firstly ismentioned in 1813.>>
The name is mentioned at least sincethe sea-battle of Salamis (480 B.C.)
<< Demosthenes rulled outmacedonians as hellens and named them barbarians or non helenes! >>
Demosthenes was an uppish Athenian.Athenians of his kind called other people (even Greeks too) asBarbarians even for trivial things.
Besides, is well known thatDemosthenes had been called a barbarian by his opponents. So,according to this Demosthenes was a barbarian too! (not at all ofcourse. There is no conclusion about Macedonians were not Greeks just from the above)
<<In those timesits createn the greatest denocide ever in the human history! >>
Relax!
<< macedonianpeople have right to recall on their properties, something which willmake total chaos!!!! >>
If so, the hundreds ofthousands of Greeks who were forced to leave their places in Krusevo,Bitola, etc have the right to come back and claim for theirproperties left there. Right?

<<We SPEAKMACEDONIAN and we are SLAVS WHO MIXED WITH PEOPLE LIVING BEFORE THEMON THIS LANDS! 90% >>
If so, you are Greco-Slavs (orSlav-Greeks if you like). In such a case we wouldn't have problem toaccept you with any name you like and at any case since you alsorecognize your Greek identity.

<< Hows thenpossible IGENEA, swiss DNA and genes scientific analysis to saymodern macedonians are the only related to ancient macedonians >>
If so, then you are geneticallyGreeks

<< Since whentell me Kutlesh Sun is with blue background >>
So far to my knowledge thereisn't any Kutlesh Sun. If you mean the Vergina Star (or Sun if youlike), you have to know that inside your country you may call anyplace of the world the way you like but speaking internationallyyou have to use the official name the sovereigncountry has given to its place. Look at me: I said Bitola just beforeand not Monastiri, which is the Greek name of this city, just becauseI am addressing to you. Regarding the Vergina star, asthe ancient Macedonians were Greeks the symbol is Greek too.

<< Does anyoneknows that Macedonians had totaly different customs and the same areused today? >>
Interesting.Name some please.
<<Alexander was never Greek >>
ok
<<Now do you know what was thefirst reaction of the Hellens when aknowledged that Macedonia wantedto participate(about Olympics)? They REFUSE and DENIED by all costs >>
Alexander’s1st attempt to enter the Olympics at around 500 BC wassuccessful despite the initial denial of some of his other Greekcompetitors as they thought that he was likely to win. It is notstated that anyone else ever protested. The Olympics Committee askedhim if he was Greek. Alexander’s excuse about the Argead originwas simply childish but this was at hand and used without any secondthought. The rest of the Greeks accepted him not because of hisArgead origin but because they knew that Macedonians were Greeks.
Thecommittee decided that he could participate as he was a Greek and nobody protested. The full story can be found in Herodote's text.I can check and find relative site if you wish.

<<ALEXANDERHAD WITH HIM TRANSLATOR SO HE COULD COMMUNICATE WITH HIS SUPPORTIVE"ARMIES"- SLAVES FROM HELLAS- BINGO >>
Not at all!
<< Poor Greece, wecould have been BROTHERS! >>
As soon as all these issuesregarding claims on Greek History and Greek territories are resolvedwe can be brothers dear Dux.  All the best!

 

FYRoM's rights to the Macedonian name are actually based on just one right, and that is the universal right to self-determine as you wish or as you see fit...so FYRoM took this right to mean it could usurp the Macedonian name exclusively, completely, totally and utterly for itself.

But FYRoM does does not have fraternal, cultural, linguistic or historic rights to that name, in the way that the Greeks espouse to have. So FYRoM's right to that name is on an equilibrium with that John Smith analogy which goes like this:

Two John Smiths could live in peace, side by side next door to each other...but if one John Smith attempts to adopt-usurp the Identity of the other one, that would be called Identity theft but in FYRoM's case, cultural thievery!

So FYRoM's rights evidently, only really extend to that one-off, that one-singular, universal right of self-determination.

It's quite absurd really, to make a song and dance about FYRoM's so called Macedonian Identity on the basis of just one right to self-determination...that would equate or be on par with wanting to self-determine as Donald Duck on the basis you could, simply because you have the right to do so!

It should be pointed out to FYRoM's ex-Yugoslavs that they do not have real or natural rights to that name...No fraternal rights, No cultural rights, No linguistic rights and No historic rights.

The only rights they have is based on that one-off, that one-singular universal right of self-determination.

FYRoM's ex-Yugoslavs celebrate Alexander the Great in Skopje under what basis...for they have No historic rights to his legacy, so why do they do it then. Ofcourse, they do it for the gratification factor they glean from watching Greeks squirm at their antics. Slavists bred them for purpose, to denigrate-destroy Hellenism and to ridicule humiliate modern Greeks.

Absurd in the extreme, right!